National Free Flight Society

SEN 1931

Table of Contents – SEN 1931

  1. Patterson 2014
  2. Another thumbs down on the weak link
  3. F1ABC Limited
  4. For consideration Classic FF or RCFF
  5. F1A Solution 🙂
  6. Plans and Things

Patterson 2014

Another great event in Lost Hills, quieter than usual as no F1C flyers this year. Low Attendance due to the finals this past month. The weather Saturday was calm and partly cloudy.

F1B fly off was decided in 5 min round with a total of four flyers. Walt Ghio was the only one who maxed. F1A had 3 flyers which went into the five min fly off round, 3 flyers left in the 7 min round and 2 flyers in the 9 min final round. Brian VanNest was high time with 230 sec in the 9 min round.

Sunday was cooler and slight breeze. F1G ended in tragedy as Tiffany and Blake in the fly off round had a mid air collision and ended in a 20 and 22 sec score. F1H had 7 fliers and 5 flyers in the fly off, three flyers in the final round 4 min resulting in the morning tie breaker round being used. Overall fantastic weather for the weekend.


F1A Rnd1 Rnd2 Rnd3 Rnd4 Rnd5 Rnd6 Rnd7 F01 FO2 FO3 total
1 Brian VanNest 210 180 180 180 180 180 180 300 420 230 2240
2 Jim Parker 210 180 180 180 180 180 180 300 420 82 2092
3 Don Zink 210 180 180 180 180 180 180 300 325 1915
4 Mike McKeever 210 180 180 180 180 146 180 1256
5 Shlomi Rosenzweig 99 180 180 180 180 180 180 1179
6 Ken Bauer 210 180 132 101 180 180 115 1098

F1B Rnd1 Rnd2 Rnd3 Rnd4 Rnd5 Rnd6 Rnd7 total
1 Walt Ghio 240 180 180 180 180 180 180 300 1620
2 Blake Jensen 240 180 180 180 180 180 180 269 1589
3 Sevak Malkhasyan 240 180 180 180 180 180 180 249 1569Jr. High Time
4 Rich Rohrke 240 180 180 180 180 180 180 1320
5 Alex Andriukov 240 180 180 180 180 180 144 1284
6 Mike Richardson 240 180 180 180 140 180 180 1280
7 Roger Morrell 240 180 180 180 133 180 101 1194
8 Dick Myers 168 144 180 160 153 180 180 1165

1 Mike Pykelyn 45 61 180 88 180 180 180 914

1 Brian VanNest 120 120 120 120 120 180 240 217 1237
2 Shlomi Rosenzweig 120 120 120 120 120 180 240 201 1221
3 Jiim Parker 120 120 120 120 120 180 240 117 1137
4 Ken Bauer 120 120 120 120 120 180 83 863
5 Mike McKeever 120 120 120 120 120 120 720
6 Lee Hines 99 76 115 120 120 530
7 Blake Jensen 41 74 0 120 120 355

1Blake Jensen 120 120 120 120 120 22 622
2Tiffany Odell 120 120 120 120 120 20 620
3Mike Robinson 120 109 120 111 120 580
4Mike Pykelyn 120 91 120 120 120 571

Another thumbs down on the weak link

Hello Roger

I have tried the weak link in the past inadvertently. It is really a STUPID idea, because all timers start functioning when the line is released from the hook. A stub of line left on the hook will lead to a fly away with the timer not started.

It took me 3 days to find my model in Florida after this happened and cost me an airplane search.

Really dumb idea.

Dave Edmonson

F1ABC Limited

I have been following along with all the discussions concerning the F1A, B, C rules that have been circulating?and I feel that we, the FAI community world wide, are spending too much time discussing rule details for each event instead of looking for ways to increase the participation in the FAI events by tweaking the current rules. I also feel that we are approaching the point that FAI Free Flight is or will be non-sustainable in the near future. While this is also true for Free flight in general it is especially true for the FAI events.?
I’m pretty sure most of you will agree that having a box full of competitive of models is getting very expensive. Over the years the number of models allowed to be process has increased from 2 to today’s 4 thus doubling the cost right off the bat whither you build your own or buy your models. I think that going from 2 to 3 models happened when the rounds were increased from 5 to 7 to allow for an extra model in case a model was lost during the rounds. At this point I would like to add that locators, transmitters, were unheard of for finding lost free flight models at that time. The increase from 3 models to 4 models came about after the 1981 World Champs in Spain, again I believe, when Eugene Verbitski ran out of models during the F1C Flyoff. Again locators were not in very much use at this time. From my personal view I have lost 1 F1A and 1 F1B that were equipped with locators since the early ’80 when I started installing locators in all my FAI models and both of these were total fly always.

With that said I think now it would be a good time to discuss reducing the number of models allowed to be process from 4 to 3, or even 2 per day. This would certainly reduce cost especially for the fliers who have to fly on commercial airlines to contest with with oversize model boxes as the airlines charge you extra for anything they think they can get away with.

A lot of the discussions I have been reading has been centered around reducing the performance of current models mostly by simple change, at least to some, that would not require new models. While this “freezing the current performance level” is a way it doesn’t address the main problem of the decreasing participation in FAI Free Flight. What I propose is adding a second set of specification for each event that a flyer could choose to build or buy. The idea would be to choose two paths to archive the same results. Over time we, the FAI community, could see the results and make better decision about the future of FAI Free Flight and rules.

Here are my thought for implementing this idea. I am only showing the second or optional rules. These rules are to be implemented only as a separate set to the current rules. I am not proposing 3 new FAI events. A flier could choose to have models that meet limited set of rules or the standard rules, or both.??

F1A Limited

1. Fixed camber, no flappers, for the wing except for one wing is allowed to have one incident change, wing wiggler, for towing and gliding.

2. Only non-bunt models allowed. Rules could be written to allow only one incident change not including DT for the stab. Basically a stab incident for towing and
gliding or even limit the stab to one fixed incident for towing and gliding.

3. No minimum model weight.

4. For models that meet the above 3 rules the towline length is increased to 75 to 80?meters.

F1B limited

1. No minimum model weight.

2. Only fixed pitch prop hubs allowed. The prop pitch, except for aero dynamic flexing, is not allowed to change during the prop run.

3. Only instant start at release is allowed for prop blades, blades may be feathered for launching.????

4. Only fixed camber wings, except for wing wigglers are allowed.

5. Amount of rubber allowed to be 10% to 15% more that the “Unlimited” rule allows.

6. Only one incidents change of the stab is allowed during the prop run.

F1C Limited

1. No minimum model weight.

2. Engine must be direct drive only.

3. Folder and/or flapper wings are not allowed.

4. Stab may only have maximum of 2 variable position, power and glide, plus DT.

5. Engine runs to be slightly, maybe 1 or 2 seconds, longer that “Unlimited” motor runs.

Please note that this is not a “Take it or Leave it” proposal. It’s too late for that this cycle. If people think this might be a way to go it could be flown along side current models in non-World Cup or Continual Championship contest for testing these rules.

The intent is not to reduce performance but to open up a class of models to compete along side of the current models on a near equal footing with only a maybe very slight disadvantage. The intent of this ideas is to reduce cost and to increase participation in FAI free flight.

Jim Bradley

For consideration – Classic FF or RCFF

Not long ago I read an interesting opinion about the ongoing evolution of the FF categories, where one individual described the issue as such: with today’s technology it is not a problem to remove the DT and add in a microprocessor to perform the same function. Likewise, it is not a problem to install a gyrocompass to aid in towing, and a variometer which can detect even the smallest lift. If we add to this flapper type wings, an impulse hook, servo mechanism, or an LDA profile, then we will have something similar to what our friends have in F3F or F3J. These aren’t new opinions, but it is worth considering what comes next. It is understandable that it is difficult to stop progress, but there is sense in managing it. What concerns me is there is a group that cannot and will not spend thousands to maintain models at this level. Likewise, there are also those who will never join in this wonderful hobby if the barrier to entry is so high.

So what to do to satisfy both sides of the debate? One solution would be to introduce sub-classifications within the same base categories at all contests. Flyers with higher technology, such as flapper type wings, LDA, or geared motors would start in a sub class, while all others would compete in the regular “classic” categories. Everyone would fly together but the scoreboards would be split in two. This would avoid the performance gap caused by differences in technology, and prevent one group of flyers from automatically feeling like they are at a serious disadvantage to be competitive before the contest even begins.

There is also the issue of radio controlled DT. This is necessary for training, but should not be used to give a competitive advantage during competitions. In my opinion, if you use RC-DT during a timed flight you should be prohibited from having a re-launch attempt – your time should stand as is, regardless of its length.

Look forward to the comments of others.

Chris Lenartowicz
F1A – Canada

F1A Solution!

from Ross Jahnke

I have the solution to the F1A towline diameter debate! Age based line
diameter. If you’re over 50 you can use the current popular towline. 40-50
year olds must use a line at least 1 mm thick. 30-40 year olds must conform
to the new proposed rules. Under 30 must use a clothesline and a pillowcase
as the flag. (Jama Danier must use a 3/8 inch steel cable.)

Editor’s comment – Ross I think some others might be disappointed that they are not in the 3/8 steel category with jama, maybe that should be the top 5 in the World Cup ?

Plans and Things

In recent discussions on FB about how bad or good technology was for Free Flight there were some words of wisdom from Don Deloach and Bruce Hannah. Paraphrasing their comments Don was for supporting all kinds of Free Flight and Bruce said that there are many different classes so you can always pick one that suits your budget, flying site and personal whims without the need to change an existing class..

All of us like going out and seeing our models up in the air. While the FAI classes tend to require big flying fields there is certainly a need for all levels of small field flying, which includes the FAI mini-events, E-36, FAC etc.

Over the years there has been a wealth of small field plans published by various sources. One of the most notable being Hannan’s Runway. The Hannans have decided to retire but fortunately the plans and various publications have been taken over by Jim and DeAnn Lueken. This even includes the remaining stock of Zaic yearbooks. Jim is one of those people who understands about all classes of aeromodelling and can make just about any airplane fly.

The web site is :

Just the place to go for the hard to satisfy spots on the Xmas gifts list.

Roger Morrell